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A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads! 
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Post A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads!
Each one, I think, would be neat to have, but not important enough to gameplay for its own thread. Each one of these can be discussed separately.


> One thought was to make the Shock Rifle sort of like a mix between a laser rifle, tesla coil and a shotgun, throwing three quite accurate and powerful particle lightning bolts per shot at around double the laser rifle's fire rate. Drawback? A tad lower range than now, and still scales fairly badly with armor. It functions best as a midrange weapon, as it's too hard to aim at close range and at long range it'll hardly land any hits.

> New suggested prices based on how effective they are: Grenade Trooper 500, Rocket Soldier 450, Time Gunner 950.

> Increase the speed of Tib Rifle projectiles, the reason I think it's been mostly abandoned is because of how slow and hard to aim/easy to dodge the darts are. Seriously, they rarely hit and when they do they don't seem to do enough damage.

> A way to make the grenade launcher not just a RL with gravity? Make it launch grenades that explode on contact with people, but otherwise have a 1.5 second timer and bounce. The plus? Higher radius and damage.

> Plasma Cannon? Give a homage to a BFG and make it chargable, like said in another thread. It can be charged up to three levels, the highest being normally a OHKO to infantry and heavily damaging to mechs. Downside? It can overheat and explode in a massive blue/red fireball if you try spamming with it.

> An alternative (or compliment) to the above note is to make the Plasma Cannon not a purchasable weapon... but its own superclass, like the Commando.

> Anyone who's played the AOW alphas knows how the mechs used to explode. In an ominous, loud buildup of the mech melting down culminating in a bright, loud and epic explosion of blinding light that players 40 feet away could definately get hurt by. Of course players had a good 8-10 seconds of very clear warning to get the hell out of there before they get vaporized.

> Frag grenades... I dunno, I don't think the shrapnel is doing its intended job. Maybe make them not rip through players and do a static 12 damage each. Also, fix the shrapnel sprites, lol.

> Lower the amount of total ammo everyone gets by say... 20%. 320 machinegun bullets, 40 shells, 32 sniper/gauss rounds, etc. I think that's a little more reasonable. Maybe 33% if we want to actually watch your ammo usage and use a variety of weapons accordingly (that's called tactics boys). That's 264 MG rounds, 32 shotgun shells (actually 33 but eh), 26 sniper/gauss ammo.

> Remove the least popular maps. They just seem to take up space. An example would be AOW10, which is nothing but long straight corridors where sniping weapons rule everything else out. Which ones would you like to see taken out?

> Here's one. HITMARKERS. Yes I know it sounds lame and rip-off-ish but it would be very satisfying and informative to hear and see a confirmation of each of your Madcat LRMs hitting that enemy Titan and knowing exactly how many of those machinegun bullets are hitting.

When it comes to keeping a playerbase entertained, change is good. Even the little things that make a player go "oooh that's cool" when they see it.


Wed Dec 14, 2011 10:02 am
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
I've got some more random suggestions :

> Modification - Timegun teleportation :
As long as you are in your base it teleports you in the enemy base. As long as you are outside the base, it teleports you back home.
The base limits to check are defined by where you can place turrets. When you teleport home, it could always be on the repair facility, nowhere else. When you teleport in the enemy base, you could always land behind buildings. Not inside them. Too risky and way too often, pointless, because you die within 5 seconds under the fire of 3 turrets.

> Modification - Advanced Mech research :
May cost 5000$. Who the hell would pay alone 5000$ for a research at the beginning of the game ? It has to be a team effort (donation), because simply, it benefits the whole team (players will play advanced mechs as long as the WF is on). Encourages strategy. And where have you seen a research costing less than one final stand-alone product ? I mean the Guardian costs 3000$ and the research 2000$. Easy to spam Advanced mech when the way to unlock them costs this few.

> Addition - Advanced Weaponry :
A new research for that broken button. Unlocks Minigunner, Jumpjet, Commando, Gauss, Plasma rifle & Cannon, Mass driver, Chem Warrior, Laser chaingun, Stealth, Beacons, and Demo-man.
Less OP right at the beginning. You have to research for it first. 2000~3000$ ?

> This one is a really tough one - Harvester mech :
Goes as fast as the Advanced Harvester. 1000 HP and doesn't loose health when you get off. Not an advanced mech, but requires Enhanced refining. Same weaknesses as other mechs. Everyone can refine with it as long as they can drive a mech, but there can only be one refining mech per team. Parkable inside the base, when you don't use it. It should somehow be more profitable to refine with it than with advanced harvesters, and more interesting, it could be a similar goal to attack it as to attack the mini-refinery, for the enemy team. So when it goes refining, it should be escorted.
Could cost 1500~2000$. Reduce drastically the profit tradionnal harvesters make to compensate. Refining point ? A wall outside the refinery just for this mech.
Keeps up with the original spirit of Command and Conquer, and adds up something more to AOW.

> Reinstatement/Addition - Airstrike :
A sudden death event. When the sudden death takes too long, airstrikes occur and drop projectiles on everything. Building's health begins gradually to drop.


Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:55 am
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Medic wrote:
> One thought was to make the Shock Rifle sort of like a mix between a laser rifle, tesla coil and a shotgun, throwing three quite accurate and powerful particle lightning bolts per shot at around double the laser rifle's fire rate. Drawback? A tad lower range than now, and still scales fairly badly with armor. It functions best as a midrange weapon, as it's too hard to aim at close range and at long range it'll hardly land any hits.

Don't know off-hand.. we'll need to talk more about this.

Medic wrote:
> New suggested prices based on how effective they are: Grenade Trooper 500, Rocket Soldier 450, Time /Gunner 950.

I'd rather see RL and grenadier redesigned before we get into the cost business..

Medic wrote:
> Increase the speed of Tib Rifle projectiles, the reason I think it's been mostly abandoned is because of how slow and hard to aim/easy to dodge the darts are. Seriously, they rarely hit and when they do they don't seem to do enough damage.

Can agree with this. I played a lot with the tib rifle one match and it could indeed use some more projectile speed. Damage is fine.

Medic wrote:
> A way to make the grenade launcher not just a RL with gravity? Make it launch grenades that explode on contact with people, but otherwise have a 1.5 second timer and bounce. The plus? Higher radius and damage.

Maybbbe.

Medic wrote:
> Plasma Cannon? Give a homage to a BFG and make it chargable, like said in another thread. It can be charged up to three levels, the highest being normally a OHKO to infantry and heavily damaging to mechs. Downside? It can overheat and explode in a massive blue/red fireball if you try spamming with it.

Interesting... we'll need to chat more about this.

Medic wrote:
> An alternative (or compliment) to the above note is to make the Plasma Cannon not a purchasable weapon... but its own superclass, like the Commando.

I suggested this once with the old team lineup and it got shot down. However if we go this route with the plasma cannon we need to give stealths something effective to defend beacons/C4 with.

Medic wrote:
> Anyone who's played the AOW alphas knows how the mechs used to explode. In an ominous, loud buildup of the mech melting down culminating in a bright, loud and epic explosion of blinding light that players 40 feet away could definately get hurt by. Of course players had a good 8-10 seconds of very clear warning to get the hell out of there before they get vaporized.

heh

Medic wrote:
> Frag grenades... I dunno, I don't think the shrapnel is doing its intended job. Maybe make them not rip through players and do a static 12 damage each. Also, fix the shrapnel sprites, lol.

Fixed the sprites, there was a name conflict. Though this is another issue we need to chat about.

Medic wrote:
> Lower the amount of total ammo everyone gets by say... 20%. 320 machinegun bullets, 40 shells, 32 sniper/gauss rounds, etc. I think that's a little more reasonable. Maybe 33% if we want to actually watch your ammo usage and use a variety of weapons accordingly (that's called tactics boys). That's 264 MG rounds, 32 shotgun shells (actually 33 but eh), 26 sniper/gauss ammo.

Gee can't those numbers be rounded down? :P Though this is another item on my wishlist but I just haven't managed to pull it out yet.

Medic wrote:
> Remove the least popular maps. They just seem to take up space. An example would be AOW10, which is nothing but long straight corridors where sniping weapons rule everything else out. Which ones would you like to see taken out?

hrm, I believe most of these maps are savorable... though the worst doers could be moved to expansion. Though I have one problem with this is, it'll leave gaps in the map list - what do we do to that?

Medic wrote:
> Here's one. HITMARKERS. Yes I know it sounds lame and rip-off-ish but it would be very satisfying and informative to hear and see a confirmation of each of your Madcat LRMs hitting that enemy Titan and knowing exactly how many of those machinegun bullets are hitting.

Another one we need to talk more about.

Joe wrote:
> Modification - Timegun teleportation :
As long as you are in your base it teleports you in the enemy base. As long as you are outside the base, it teleports you back home.
The base limits to check are defined by where you can place turrets. When you teleport home, it could always be on the repair facility, nowhere else. When you teleport in the enemy base, you could always land behind buildings. Not inside them. Too risky and way too often, pointless, because you die within 5 seconds under the fire of 3 turrets.

That latter part is pretty much impossible to implement: all spawn spots have the same TID and there is no way to tell reliably which is inside the building and which is outside...

Though I have plans for time cop that hopefully get in the next build.

Joe wrote:
> Modification - Advanced Mech research :
May cost 5000$. Who the hell would pay alone 5000$ for a research at the beginning of the game ? It has to be a team effort (donation), because simply, it benefits the whole team (players will play advanced mechs as long as the WF is on). Encourages strategy. And where have you seen a research costing less than one final stand-alone product ? I mean the Guardian costs 3000$ and the research 2000$. Easy to spam Advanced mech when the way to unlock them costs this few.

The real issue here is inflation. Fixing that will fix this in the process as well. Though if we do that mechs should cost less...

Joe wrote:
> Addition - Advanced Weaponry :
A new research for that broken button. Unlocks Minigunner, Jumpjet, Commando, Gauss, Plasma rifle & Cannon, Mass driver, Chem Warrior, Laser chaingun, Stealth, Beacons, and Demo-man.
Less OP right at the beginning. You have to research for it first. 2000~3000$ ?

This idea is on the table as well..

Joe wrote:
> This one is a really tough one - Harvester mech :
Goes as fast as the Advanced Harvester. 1000 HP and doesn't loose health when you get off. Not an advanced mech, but requires Enhanced refining. Same weaknesses as other mechs. Everyone can refine with it as long as they can drive a mech, but there can only be one refining mech per team. Parkable inside the base, when you don't use it. It should somehow be more profitable to refine with it than with advanced harvesters, and more interesting, it could be a similar goal to attack it as to attack the mini-refinery, for the enemy team. So when it goes refining, it should be escorted.
Could cost 1500~2000$. Reduce drastically the profit tradionnal harvesters make to compensate. Refining point ? A wall outside the refinery just for this mech.
Keeps up with the original spirit of Command and Conquer, and adds up something more to AOW.

Actually I had a partial implenetation done for this, if one looks hard enough in the sprites and ACS one might see traces of the "Scavenger". :P
The problem? Maps. We'd need to add refining points to every map.. this would mean altering the structure of every Refinery.

Joe wrote:
> Reinstatement/Addition - Airstrike :
A sudden death event. When the sudden death takes too long, airstrikes occur and drop projectiles on everything. Building's health begins gradually to drop.

I have degeneration implemented for next build. Though it starts right at sudden death's beginning. Air strikes though have one problem - where to initially spawn them so that they'd effectively cover every corner of the map?


Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:12 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Dusk wrote:
Air strikes though have one problem - where to initially spawn them so that they'd effectively cover every corner of the map?
Just drop a bunch of bombs and cheat by lowering building health with ACS. :P


Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:20 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Extra one: Lower the amount of zoom on the sniper rifle, lower the amount of spread unscoped.


Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:47 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Medic wrote:
> A way to make the grenade launcher not just a RL with gravity? Make it launch grenades that explode on contact with people, but otherwise have a 1.5 second timer and bounce. The plus? Higher radius and damage.

Didn't people dislike the old bouncy grenades? :?


Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:04 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
I like old grenade trooper (with old strife sprite - aow version 1816), that was really strong class, stronger than in this version. I think it is remade cuz its overpowered ? I really don't know, I support old one.

And I am against air strike of any kind cuz I am hard working util guy, if they destroy my defenses that will be frustrating. No way I will build it over and over again cuz of some bombing. And if bombing arrive in very unpleasan't time such as defusing or planting beacon. Don't like this idea. I support for current SD.

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Wed Dec 14, 2011 3:44 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Qent wrote:
Medic wrote:
> A way to make the grenade launcher not just a RL with gravity? Make it launch grenades that explode on contact with people, but otherwise have a 1.5 second timer and bounce. The plus? Higher radius and damage.

Didn't people dislike the old bouncy grenades? :?

The old bouncy grenades? Well, the difference between those and the new ones, well...

1. They bounced WAY too easily, like, they lost no speed whatsoever. They were impossible to aim because they bounced absolutely everywhere. If it's more realistic (they're metal grenades ffs, not basketballs) then it'd be far far easier to aim. Think of it as sort of like frag grenades with a little less power and no shrapnel, and fired out of a launcher instead.

2. Welp, the old ones also detonated themselves on the 3rd bounce, and since they bounced bloody 5 miles away from where they were aimed, yeah. I can see why the players disliked that :P


EDIT:

Joe wrote:
> This one is a really tough one - Harvester mech.
[stuff about its stats]


Since the rest of your post got mentioned, I figure I might as well say why have that when you have Ravens right there for that very purpose? Plus, compared to the vehicle you described, it's faster, has more health, and is armed enough to ward away the occasional threat. I use Ravens as attack mechs here and there, but you get my drift.


Wed Dec 14, 2011 4:37 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
The only problem with ravens is the theoretical possibility of idiots stealing them...


Wed Dec 14, 2011 10:13 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
You can still pick up the crystals in a raven by running over them. The only way they'd get stolen is if you parked it right outside of the ref door to drop off your crystal and some derp walked through said door into the Raven and said "fuck it, free ride"


Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:35 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Dusk wrote:
Joe wrote:
> Modification - Timegun teleportation :
[...]
When you teleport in the enemy base, you could always land behind buildings. Not inside them. Too risky and way too often, pointless, because you die within 5 seconds under the fire of 3 turrets.

That latter part is pretty much impossible to implement: all spawn spots have the same TID and there is no way to tell reliably which is inside the building and which is outside...

Though I have plans for time cop that hopefully get in the next build.

When you spawn as a mech in the war factory or in the spawn room, there are specific spawn points right, why not make it so ?


Qent wrote:
Dusk wrote:
Air strikes though have one problem - where to initially spawn them so that they'd effectively cover every corner of the map?
Just drop a bunch of bombs and cheat by lowering building health with ACS. :P

Maybe also spawn projectiles in a radius over where each players are ?
For the buildings, just like a reduced base crasher.

Medic wrote:
Joe wrote:
> This one is a really tough one - Harvester mech.
[stuff about its stats]


Since the rest of your post got mentioned, I figure I might as well say why have that when you have Ravens right there for that very purpose? Plus, compared to the vehicle you described, it's faster, has more health, and is armed enough to ward away the occasional threat. I use Ravens as attack mechs here and there, but you get my drift.

But Raven is a war mech. I forgot to mention this Scavenger would have very few weapons.
First it could also run over the infantry, like any other mechs.
I first throught of minigun as a weapon, but that would be OP at his potential speed.
Then as long as it carries tiberium (might pick up to five crystal ?) it could be using them as ammo for spraying chemicals. If it uses too much, no tiberium left to bring back home.
It could then be abused to hold and defend the tiberium fields with limitless ammos, that's why it needs to have very few HP and be vulnerable to rockets, have the life length of an orca.
In the original game it has no weapons at all, except being able to run over.


Dusk wrote:
The only problem with ravens is the theoretical possibility of idiots stealing them...

It's a fact that technology will never solve the problems with idiots, only make it worse.


Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:09 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Joe wrote:
But Raven is a war mech. I forgot to mention this Scavenger would have very few weapons.
First it could also run over the infantry, like any other mechs.
I first throught of minigun as a weapon, but that would be OP at his potential speed.
Then as long as it carries tiberium (might pick up to five crystal ?) it could be using them as ammo for spraying chemicals. If it uses too much, no tiberium left to bring back home.
It could then be abused to hold and defend the tiberium fields with limitless ammos, that's why it needs to have very few HP and be vulnerable to rockets, have the life length of an orca.
In the original game it has no weapons at all, except being able to run over.


Well... Yeah. Actually, Ravens are Inner Sphere Light mechs, and that means it's mostly scouting and skirmishing. It's not really heavily armed enough for serious combat like a Wolverine or Madcat. It's fast enough to outrun any of them though, and most people. So it's not really a war mech, it's a light recon mech.

Besides, the Raven still does a better job in every one of those categories. Yes, the Raven is faster than an advanced harvester, but it doesn't look like it since it has like the highest cockpit of any mech. Except for the idea of holding multiple crystals, the Raven gives you a pretty safe and fast ride to the tib and back. You're immune to what most tib rushers use: SSGs, machineguns, flamers, snipers. You know. You're coming from a good direction, but there's pretty much a "harvester's best friend" mech already is all I'm saying.


Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:51 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
I think that maybe better is to harvesting mech to be some orca, you pickup a crystal and you drop it, by selecting item, in some green acid pool of refinery. With aircraft you can harvest more efficient than with ground mech. And orca is hard to kill without gauss though. Players don't buy it in WF, it appears as soon as Enhanced Reffining is researched and can be taken from some platform near reffinery. If it is destroyed another appears for 3 minutes on platform. Players can park it only on platform otherwise destroyed. These are mine ideas.

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Fri Dec 16, 2011 4:59 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
That's a neat idea, but a pretty huge undertaking to remodel all of the refineries and coding to make that work. That would probably be in its own topic or something.


Sat Dec 17, 2011 12:50 am
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Medic wrote:
Besides, the Raven still does a better job in every one of those categories. Yes, the Raven is faster than an advanced harvester, but it doesn't look like it since it has like the highest cockpit of any mech. Except for the idea of holding multiple crystals, the Raven gives you a pretty safe and fast ride to the tib and back. You're immune to what most tib rushers use: SSGs, machineguns, flamers, snipers. You know. You're coming from a good direction, but there's pretty much a "harvester's best friend" mech already is all I'm saying.

The Raven is so big it's too easy to gauss it. The mech I'm talking about would be the smallest mech.
I saw once a sprite that could fit it in a coop WAD, I'll make a special topic for it.


Sun Dec 18, 2011 6:43 am
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Joe wrote:
Dusk wrote:
Joe wrote:
> Modification - Timegun teleportation :
[...]
When you teleport in the enemy base, you could always land behind buildings. Not inside them. Too risky and way too often, pointless, because you die within 5 seconds under the fire of 3 turrets.

That latter part is pretty much impossible to implement: all spawn spots have the same TID and there is no way to tell reliably which is inside the building and which is outside...

Though I have plans for time cop that hopefully get in the next build.

When you spawn as a mech in the war factory or in the spawn room, there are specific spawn points right, why not make it so ?

Too much work for too little gain... all maps would have to be updated plus who knows what would break.
It would be interesting though, to control whether something spawns inside or outside.


Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:42 pm
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
Here's one. Make remote c4 react faster upon pressing the trigger.

Trying to actually catch people in its explosion is hard as hell since they beep so loud for so long :c Players have the chance to avoid them by seeing their large sprites and the guy with the detonator out watching for players. Giving them the chance to live despite both of those give-away warnings, I think, is a bit too forgiving.

It's not something that was caused by a recent match or anything, but it's one of those persistent annoyances.

Hell, maybe even give the guy 5 remote c4, the guy's not used enough for offense as it is.


Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:45 am
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Post Re: A shitmix of tweaks not big enough for their own threads
f, forgot that


Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:57 pm
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